RE: First time for everything
"Andrew Warren" <awarren -at- synaptics -dot- com>
"Ned Bedinger" <doc -at- edwordsmith -dot- com>, <vrfour -at- verizon -dot- net>
Sun, 5 Nov 2006 23:41:43 -0800
Ned Bedinger wrote:
> James Barrow wrote:
> >> On Sunday, November 05, 2006 12:41 AM, Ned Bedinger said:
> >>> James Barrow wrote:
> >>> Although I received an application and disclosure form from my
> >>> employer's HR department, and have verbally accepted my manager's
> offer of
> >>> full time, I have procrastinated in sending the application back
> to HR.
> >>> Why? Well, although the compensation that I was offered is good,
> >>> week was the Week of Personality Conflicts. I began to wonder if
> I really
> >>> wanted to work in that environment.
> >> You don't sound like you especially need this job as a career move
> >> skill builder. I'll assume that you could opt out without undue
> > Not especially. I've honed my Frame skills, learned how to use
> > and have gone from "expert" to "guru" with WebWorks. Beyond that,
> this job
> > has been much like the others.
> >>> At the same time, I received two calls from recruiters regarding
> >>> positions in the same industry. The pay range for both of these
> >>> are significantly more than what I was offered from my current
> >>> Sig...nif...i...cant...ly.
> >> Nice timing.
> > Story of my tech writer life. When I read posts about 'feast or
> famine' or
> > 'time between contracts', I thank my massive, compact bodies of
> plasma in
> > outer space. In 15 years as a teach writer, I have never been out
> of work
> > for more than one day.
> Wow! My patron from outer space is The Big-Eyed Beans From Venus.
> to them, I also have had remarkable runs of plentiful, interesting
> I've taken staff positions along the way, but the industries I hook
> with are damnably plastic--they make some acquisitions, rise to
> major-player status,hire everyone in sight, and provide 401K
> matching. A
> couple of years later, they're staging all-hands meetings to tell us
> that we've been acquired and the HR department will be available to
> us find new jobs.
> So, you're in cahoots with the most fortunate celebrities who
> the celestial big screen?? That's wicked cool. I may have to consider
> this at more length.
> >> Can I assume that you're well-qualified in your industry and that
> >> industry snaps up qualified tech writers?
> > That's actually a trick question. The industry in question is the
> > Entertainment industry. It's the same as any other sector or
> > (IMO), but several recruiters have said the same thing: "Once
> you've worked
> > in that industry, you're "in".
> I've worked in commercial software, telecom, and manufacturing, to
> a few, and I see them as doing the same thing you're describing.. My
> region has giants like Microsoft, Boeing, Cingular, Seimens, The
> ...), where contractors are golden if they can land a contract and do
> respectable job of delivering the required goods. They'll get
> over and over. Of course, an ongoing "Hiring Freeze" is often in
> (manufacturing and services stockholders love it), so the contracting
> picture I see is not so rosy that I anymore go skipping from one
> contract to the next. I've been happy working more and more for state
> government, where I get to (finally) work in IT production
> where they're customizing major packages like SAP, or developing
> software using the latest and greatest methodology. State government
> processes A LOT of data. Their IT is about as fun as it was in
> which is like a 100-ring circus. Fun!
> >> Or are we proceeding on the assumption that these are 'just
> >> calls' with unknown odds that they'll take you to the next level?
> > (There's a lightbulb flickering above my head). IT in the
> > industry is a bit more hectic than in other industries that I've
> worked. If
> > IT gets a call from an Exec VP requesting a software application,
> and he
> > wants it yesterday, IT is expected to turn back time to meet that
> Ewww. Sorry, that just slipped out. I have a permanent mental image
> The Unreasonable Executive gouged into my view of work. When they
> trouble, the earth moves, reorgs happen, departments fold their tents
> and go silently into the night. My career quest has been to find the
> place where executives, managers, and 'contributors' understand each
> other very well and take each other seriously. I can feel it in my
> bones, it must be possible to work in a level-headed organization. If
> never hear another mutton-headed developer, manager or (heaven
> executive asserting that tech writers are just glorified
> it will be too soon. Still, adrenaline junkies do get used to the
> pressures of IT, don't we :-)
> >>> To keep my options open, I authorized the recruiters that called
> to submit
> >>> me to the client companies.
> >> I suppose that some recruiters or their corporate clients wouldn't
> >> appreciate you taking this step if you're not more or less
> interested in
> >> an offer. But of course that's the cost of doing business, and you
> >> like a straight shooter, so as far as I can tell you've still got
> >> integrity.
> > When I contacted my current recruiter he said that he was
> completely unaware
> > that I was offered FTE.
> This gets another WOW! Recruiters I have worked with can earn a
> fee for sending a contractor that gets hired as staff. Last time I
> hired from contract, the new boss paid something like the equivalent
> 3 or 6-months of the fees they would have paid if I remained on
> to them. I would have thought your recruiter would have been all over
> the topic of getting you hired. Wowow.
> > No biggie. When I told him the salary that I had
> > accepted, he laughed at me (yeah, WTF?). He said that he could
> have gotten
> > me more money if I had called him first.
> Big hat, no cattle.
> > Okay, thanks for making me feel
> > like a boob (notice the subject of this email). This is the first
> time that
> > I have been offered full time once my contract was fulfilled.
> >>> As an FYI, I have completed the project that I was originally
> hired for.
> >>> That being said, here is Jim's short list of ethical dilemmas
> >>> Since the last thing I told my manager before he left to work
> off-site was
> >>> that I accepted his offer of full time, I'm guessing that later
> >>> that offer AND submitting my resignation would burn this bridge.
> >>> concur? Disagree?
> >> Nope, but you know better than I how flexible or inflexible your
> >> worksite manager is--the fact that you appear a bit worried about
> >> suggests to me that you're working with someone who occupies
> >> the serious-minded axis, to whom a deal is a deal, and who might
> not be
> >> happy for you or accepting of your decision, especially when you
> >> that your changing fortunes have caused you to rethink your
> > My manager is a very serious about work and, as I previously
> posted, used
> > the word 'loyalty' several times when discussing FTE.
> Is the entertainment industry fraught with espionage & intrigue, and
> peopled with self-aggrandizing ambitious cut-throats? That's sort of
> what comes to mind. Loyalties are important, but indoctrination takes
> >> I would advise you to leave the truth about your change of mind
> >> in the sub-subtext when you do this. Your instincts should be
> >> you the facts that you and your boss need to bridge. It is all
> >> self-reconciling: "I was hired to do what I did and now I am done.
> >> changed my mind about staying and I know why, but I don't intend
> >> elaborate on that, so if there are any issues, you can reach me
> >> my agency, and now I'll be moving on." You get the idea?
> > That pretty much sums it up.
> > 
> >>> Although I believe that honesty is the best policy, what the heck
> am I
> >>> going to tell my manager is the reason for declining his offer
> >>> resigning? I really don't think it's appropriate to discuss the
> >>> personality conflicts I mentioned above (makes me sound like a
> >> Diplomatic tact is your best bet. I can't offer you better advice
> >> you are going to reveal something pretty drastic that you've
> withheld from
> >> the discussion so far.
> > Nope, nothing drastic, although the individual personality
> conflicts are
> > interesting (IMHO). When one of the project managers mentioned
> that my
> > online tutorial webpage should be 'prettied up', I offered my
> services to my
> > manager. The project manager went ballistic, sending several
> emails stating
> > that he didn't believe I knew what I was doing and that I was
> lying. When I
> > went to discuss this with him, I found him sweating and rocking
> back and
> > forth in his office.
> Oh, oh oh. What a complete drag. Your first instinct was right--drop
> them like a hot rock.
> >>> What should I tell my current recruiter (since I actually work
> for him)?
> >> They hear it all the time: "I've found a new opportunity that I
> want to
> >> take." If you're on good terms, they'll want to keep it that way
> >> you'll come work for them again. You're not screwing anyone over,
> >> you?
> > I don't think so. I have a lunchtime interview with a potential
> > tomorrow and, if they want to hire me, I'll certainly try and give
> > current employer two weeks notice.
> You mean give your recruiter 2-weeks notice? Did they ask for it?
> >>> Believe me when I say that I am fairly able to deal with just
> >>> anybody, but last week was a nightmare. Imagine every
> >>> quirky/arrogant/abrasive/obnoxious co-worker you've ever had the
> >>> displeasure to work with, and that was what last week was like
> for me.
> >> OK, now you've done it. One bad week is not much of a reason to
> > >from a gig where they like your work and you're content with the
> >> Are you saying this co-worker went off on you instead of welcoming
> >> to the club?
> > Good phrase. The project manager mentioned above has real issues
> > class. Status and power and doesn't miss an opportunity to
> highlight others'
> > mistakes to our manager. Couple this with his extreme
> competitiveness, and
> > it's bad ("Hey Jim, how do you like your new office? I think
> > bigger")
> Roger. That sort of hotshot energy is perfect for pumping up
> Hotshots, I think they are good at getting things done, but I think
> would go crazy managing tech writing. Is this guy an ex-NFL lineman
> something? Marketing could use him to make sales presentations,
> But I can't imagine harnessing it to any good effect in cubie-ville.
> Good call, Jim. Jump as soon as you're got your parachute strapped on
> tight. Happy landing!
> >> Like, they set up a big blaster by your desk at 6 AM (when you do
> your best
> >> work) and blared "A little bit of Monica in my life, a little bit
> of ..."
> >> all morning as if you wasn't even there? I had a co-worker who did
> >> like that. Is that the magnitude of the indignity you're talking
> > Hehe..nothing quite that bad. When we first started, lunch was a
> big thing
> > - we all ate together as a group. In the last six months, this guy
> > drawn some clear lines between permanent employees and contractors.
> > believes that these two groups shouldn't co-mingle in the
> cafeteria. Again,
> > just annoying
> You know, there might be some practical business reason for not
> assimilating contractors into the regular staff culture. Or it might
> truly be as extreme as it sounds. Hey that would be a good name for a
> company: X-Stream. I'm going to google it, no doubt some kid down the
> coast has had it trademarked for years..
> >>> Your comments are appreciated,
> >> Oh sure, I've seen how you handle commitment.
> >> Heh heh. :-)
> >>> Subveni, Domine! Habemus aliam felem!
> >>> (Lord help us! We have another cat!)
> >> --Ned "Not a cat person."
> > LOL! Would you like one or two for the weekend?
> Are they up to the law of the jungle? I have a manx attack cat,
> for security, it has never been petted :->.
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- RE: First time for everything, James Barrow
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